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Thread: New Install Engine Fires and Immediately Dies?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2022
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Posts
    19

    Default New Install Engine Fires and Immediately Dies?

    Terminator X Max on a 4.6 Modular engine. New Install.
    Main power harness connected directly to battery, along with solid red loose wire.
    Red/white wire connected to switched power, hot in run and start.
    Green wire to separate 30 amp relay.
    Chassis ground shows 0 resistance to negative battery terminal.
    Holley fuses (40 amp and 20 amp) are good.
    I don't have a datalog yet, but was wondering if anyone can point me in the right direction.

    Turn key, diagnostic LEDs come on, touchscreen powers up. I went through the Wizard and chose all the correct options.
    Fuel pump primes, then turns off after 5 seconds. Battery is fully charged, 12.6V. TPS is 0%, 100% at WOT. Coolant temp is same as ambient air. Fuel pressure is 43 psi, set using power probe to run the fuel pump with engine off.

    The car will crank, and start, then immediately dies. Tried using a little gas pedal but no dice. The fuel pump relay tests out good.
    My MAP sensor seems to reading a little low at 76%, I'm pretty close to sea level. But all of the other numbers seem to check out within desired range. Checked for vacuum leaks, found none. The car does not stumble or stutter, it starts with authority but then just dies. I did tee into the vacuum line for the fuel pressure regulator for the internal MAP sensor. Could this be my issue? Should I run a separate vacuum line just for the MAP?

    I have gone through several of the startup checklists, and so far everything seems fine like it should run. I'm new at this so go easy on me, LOL.
    I didn't check spark yet, but if I had no spark then the engine wouldn't fire? I also used the power probe to power the fuel pump and start it with no change.

    I don't have a laptop yet, I'm guessing I need that to post a datalog? I can datalog the startup, will that help me figure this out using only the handheld?

    I see IAC percentages, and fuel enrichments, but I'm afraid to go changing stuff.
    I'll continue to read through the threads here to try and find a solution, but if anyone could share any info that would be great. Thanks and have a nice day.
    Terminator X Max in a '79 Mercury Zephyr. 32V 4.6L & 4R70W

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Connecticut
    Posts
    31,161

    Default

    The base calibration is probably too lean or too rich. First ensure all this is correct: http://forums.holley.com/showthread....ents-Read-This (Initial Checks & Adjustments - Read Steps #1-#6!)

    Overlay the datalog onto your Config File, and pay special attention to the center paragraph in blue print:
    Originally Posted by Danny Cabral
    Quick Datalogger Information:
    Always provide data, not just symptoms. Is the AFR & ignition timing optimized? Overlay the datalog onto your Config File.
    Ensure the Target A/F Ratio table is properly programmed for your engine. Ensure the ECU is "Learning" (Learn Table LINK).
    Scroll through the datalog to the problem area. Then look exactly where this happens on the Base Fuel & Timing Tables. Scrutinize:
    RPM, MAP, MAT, TPS, CTS, IAC, Target AFR, AFR Left, CL Comp, Ignition Timing, Duty Cycle, Fuel Flow, Fuel Pressure & Battery. When the engine is tuned & running well, you should decrease the Closed Loop & Learned Compensation Limits % to lock in a good tune.

    Using the Holley Terminator X EFI software (LINK), look at where the live cursor moves to during this occurrence,
    and manually tune that area of the Base Fuel Table (enrich or lean) & Base Timing Table (optimize ignition timing).


    I find the most helpful datalog function, is overlaying the datalog on your Config File.
    I'm in the habit of using the datalog Overlay feature every time I review a datalog.
    Click on "Datalog" (on the top Toolbar), "Activate Overlay", then "Open Data Log".
    You can literally "playback" a recorded event, and watch it as it happened on any screen.
    Minimize (shrink) the datalog window, and move it to the bottom of any Config File screen.
    Then click & scroll anywhere on the datalog, and watch it playback on your Config File (EFI software).
    http://documents.holley.com/techlibr...9r10543rev.pdf (Holley EFI Datalogger Instructions)
    https://forums.holley.com/showthread...s-amp-Datalogs (Datalog Information - Read "NOTES")
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iqHO...C6FEA0BB99AF17 (How To Record & Email A Datalog)
    https://forums.holley.com/showthread...7531#post77531 (Closed Loop Datalog Tuning - Posts #2, #4 & #6)
    http://forums.holley.com/showthread....2523#post62523 (Read 4th & 5th Paragraphs - Smooth Fuel Graph After Transfer Learning)
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385"/6.3L SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, forged steel crank & rods, forged pistons, Trick Flow T/W 11R 205 CNC comp ported heads, 12:1 comp ratio, 232°-244° duration/.623" lift/114° LSA camshaft, TFS R-Series FTI comp ported intake, BBK 80mm T/B, Holley Dominator MPFI & DIS, Holley 36-1 crank trigger, MSD 1x cam sync, PA PMGR starter, PA 200A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, R134a A/C, Spal dual 12" fans, Frostbite 3-core aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust, off-road X-pipe, shorty headers, Earl's -6AN fuel system plumbing, Walbro 255 LPH in-tank pump & Pro-M -6AN hanger, S&W subframe connectors, BMR upper & lower torque box reinforcements, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD, 3000 RPM C6 converter, B&M Hammer shifter, Stifflers transmission crossmember & driveshaft safety loop, FPP aluminum driveshaft, FPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 M/T Street Comp tires.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2022
    Location
    Massachusetts
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    Thank you for the speedy response! I made some adjustments to the fuel and no change. I did datalog the situation, once I get a laptop I'll post up.
    Terminator X Max in a '79 Mercury Zephyr. 32V 4.6L & 4R70W

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Bostwick, GA
    Posts
    537

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    Quote Originally Posted by massacre View Post
    My MAP sensor seems to reading a little low at 76%, I'm pretty close to sea level.
    Is this 76 kPa? KOEO? Should read considerably higher close to sea level.

    Quote Originally Posted by massacre View Post
    I did tee into the vacuum line for the fuel pressure regulator for the internal MAP sensor. Could this be my issue? Should I run a separate vacuum line just for the MAP?
    I would do a dedicated line. But that's "just me".
    Last edited by Chuck L.; 06-23-2022 at 06:07 AM.
    Injector Inspector
    USAF 1960-1964
    Drag racing since 1955

  5. #5
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    Dec 2009
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    Connecticut
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    Yeah, I'm sure he means MAP kPa. If so, 76 kPa at key-on/engine-off indicates a problem at sea level.
    Yes, the MAP sensor should be on its own separate vacuum hose, not shared with anything else.
    Also, the MAP sensor vacuum hose should be connected to the (full manifold vacuum) plenum, not an individual runner.
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385"/6.3L SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, forged steel crank & rods, forged pistons, Trick Flow T/W 11R 205 CNC comp ported heads, 12:1 comp ratio, 232°-244° duration/.623" lift/114° LSA camshaft, TFS R-Series FTI comp ported intake, BBK 80mm T/B, Holley Dominator MPFI & DIS, Holley 36-1 crank trigger, MSD 1x cam sync, PA PMGR starter, PA 200A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, R134a A/C, Spal dual 12" fans, Frostbite 3-core aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust, off-road X-pipe, shorty headers, Earl's -6AN fuel system plumbing, Walbro 255 LPH in-tank pump & Pro-M -6AN hanger, S&W subframe connectors, BMR upper & lower torque box reinforcements, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD, 3000 RPM C6 converter, B&M Hammer shifter, Stifflers transmission crossmember & driveshaft safety loop, FPP aluminum driveshaft, FPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 M/T Street Comp tires.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2022
    Location
    Massachusetts
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    Default

    Sorry, yes kPa. MAP has gone up to around 100 kPa since. I'll move to a separate vacuum line and see if that helps. In the plenum.
    This has to be something simple, the car fires like clockwork. Thanks so much guys I appreciate the advice, even though I don't have a datalog yet.

    Regarding laptops, I was looking at the Dell Latitiude 10. Is this a good choice? I do have an old laptop that has USB, but it does not have an SD card. Thanks again.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Bostwick, GA
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    Quote Originally Posted by massacre View Post
    I do have an old laptop that has USB, but it does not have an SD card.
    Lots of inexpensive readers on Amazon. <$20 and you're in business.
    Last edited by Chuck L.; 06-23-2022 at 08:48 AM.

  8. #8

    Default

    Does it continue to run when you move from "start" to "run", or does it die as soon as you turn the key back from start? Are you able to turn on the ignition and watch the handheld to ensure you have a valid RPM signal when someone jumps the starter? It does sound a lot like a MAP reading error, but we can see this in a datalog. As ChuckL mentioned, there are a number of inexpensive USB to SD adapters. Look for one that supports the large as well as small SD card sizes.

  9. #9
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    May 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by massacre View Post
    Red/white wire connected to switched power, hot in run and start.
    @GPatrick: I saw this and wondered?

  10. #10
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    Dec 2009
    Location
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    Yes, ensure the Switched +12V red/white wire (pink wire - Sniper EFI) is powered in the "Run" and "Crank" key positions (and transitioning from "Crank" to "Run" and vice-versa).
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385"/6.3L SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, forged steel crank & rods, forged pistons, Trick Flow T/W 11R 205 CNC comp ported heads, 12:1 comp ratio, 232°-244° duration/.623" lift/114° LSA camshaft, TFS R-Series FTI comp ported intake, BBK 80mm T/B, Holley Dominator MPFI & DIS, Holley 36-1 crank trigger, MSD 1x cam sync, PA PMGR starter, PA 200A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, R134a A/C, Spal dual 12" fans, Frostbite 3-core aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust, off-road X-pipe, shorty headers, Earl's -6AN fuel system plumbing, Walbro 255 LPH in-tank pump & Pro-M -6AN hanger, S&W subframe connectors, BMR upper & lower torque box reinforcements, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD, 3000 RPM C6 converter, B&M Hammer shifter, Stifflers transmission crossmember & driveshaft safety loop, FPP aluminum driveshaft, FPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 M/T Street Comp tires.

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