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Thread: Another No Start

  1. #1

    Default Another No Start

    Like many who post I'm a new HP user. I believe I have everything in my EFI software setup properly, but obviously I'm missing something. I have a 460 Ford with a TFI distributor that's locked. When I crank I have spark, but WBO2 reads 30+ AFR as if injectors are dead. Obviously, it'll try to hit and then nothing. If I pour a little gas down the throttle body and then Crank it fires right up and runs decent. I have an off idle stumble that I need to work out, but that's a problem for another day. Or is that possibly another symptom of my no start? I also did check and I do have power on the red wire during run & crank. Does anybody have any direction for me? Everything must be close to right since it runs, but obviously there's some parameter I'm missing.

  2. #2

    Default

    So if you pour gas down the throttle body it will start and continue to run on its own? Andrew
    Instagram: @projectgattago
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  3. #3
    Join Date
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    http://forums.holley.com/showthread....5760#post45760 (Scroll down to "Typical No-Start Checks".)
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385"/6.3L SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, forged steel crank & rods, forged pistons, Trick Flow T/W 11R 205 CNC comp ported heads, 12:1 comp ratio, 232°-244° duration/.623" lift/114° LSA camshaft, TFS R-Series FTI comp ported intake, BBK 80mm T/B, Holley Dominator MPFI & DIS, Holley 36-1 crank trigger, MSD 1x cam sync, PA 200A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, R134a A/C, Spal dual 12" fans, Frostbite 3-core aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust, off-road X-pipe, shorty headers, Earl's -6AN fuel system plumbing, Walbro 255 LPH in-tank pump & Pro-M -6AN hanger, S&W subframe connectors, BMR upper & lower torque box reinforcements, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD, 3000 RPM converter, B&M Hammer shifter, Stifflers transmission crossmember & driveshaft safety loop, FPP aluminum driveshaft, FPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 M/T Street Comp tires.

  4. #4

    Default

    Correct Andrew. Once it lights off, it continues to run on its own, and AFR looks good (at least as good as it could to have only been run 5 or 6 times). It does stumble pretty bad if you quickly rev it or dies off if you let off of the accelerator quickly, but if you slowly accelerate or let off, it does just fine. Those are issues I'll work on later, just throwing it out there in case it could be related.

  5. #5
    Join Date
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    Forum members will want to see your Global File and a datalog of this occurrence.

    This is a copy & paste from one of my other posts:
    Originally Posted by Danny Cabral
    For further assistance, post your Global File and a short datalog of this occurrence for us to analyze.
    Also, review the datalog and inform us of exactly where in the datalog (time/seconds) the problem occurs.
    Datalog & Global Files must be linked to a document hosting website. I use Dropbox.com.
    Files can also be "zipped" (compressed zipped folder) & attached directly to a forum post ("Go Advanced" & "Attachments").
    Your Global File is in the "Documents", "Holley", "HEFI V5", "Global Files" folder (.hefi file).
    Your Datalogs are in the "Documents", "Holley", "HEFI V5", "Datalogs" folder (.V5.dl file).
    Someone will analyze/troubleshoot the problem & offer advice. Also, ensure all this is right:
    http://forums.holley.com/showthread....ents-Read-This (Initial Checks & Adjustments - Read Steps #1-#6!)
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385"/6.3L SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, forged steel crank & rods, forged pistons, Trick Flow T/W 11R 205 CNC comp ported heads, 12:1 comp ratio, 232°-244° duration/.623" lift/114° LSA camshaft, TFS R-Series FTI comp ported intake, BBK 80mm T/B, Holley Dominator MPFI & DIS, Holley 36-1 crank trigger, MSD 1x cam sync, PA 200A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, R134a A/C, Spal dual 12" fans, Frostbite 3-core aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust, off-road X-pipe, shorty headers, Earl's -6AN fuel system plumbing, Walbro 255 LPH in-tank pump & Pro-M -6AN hanger, S&W subframe connectors, BMR upper & lower torque box reinforcements, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD, 3000 RPM converter, B&M Hammer shifter, Stifflers transmission crossmember & driveshaft safety loop, FPP aluminum driveshaft, FPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 M/T Street Comp tires.

  6. #6

    Default

    OK. It may be a day or two before I can due to work. Please keep an eye open. I did verify this much this morning:

    Is the battery fully charged? - Yes
    Have you performed a TPS Autoset? - Yes
    Is the engine cranking fast enough (100+ RPM)? - Yes
    Does the Data Monitor display legitimate cranking RPM?
    Does the Data Monitor display legitimate sensor values?
    Does a Datalog indicate any RPM Errors?
    Is the throttle blade(s) open far enough to start? - Yes, have tried just off idle as well.
    Are the crank & cam sensor/reluctor air gaps set correctly? - N/A
    Do the crank & cam sensors have power & ground? - Yes
    Keyed +12V red/white wire powered "Run" and "Crank" key positions? - Yes
    Fuel pressure set to proper psi (Actual System Pressure)?
    All fuel injectors spraying fuel psi, and all coils produce spark (LINK)?
    Does the fuel pump prime for 5 seconds at key-on? - Yes
    Correct fuel injectors selected (high or low impedance) in Engine Parameters?
    Is the ECU controlling timing?
    Does a timing light indicate there's spark/ignition? - Yes
    What does your ignition system consist of? - Ford TFS Module Distributor
    Correct Ignition Type entered in Ignition Parameters?
    Are the spark plugs fuel fouled/wet? - No
    Is the ignition timing synchronized with the ECU?
    Are you running in sequential mode? If so, check the cam sync sensor triggering.
    Air or Coolant Temp Enrichment Modifiers erroneously set to 0% or 70%?
    The engine won't start if the throttle is opened beyond the "Clear Flood TPS" setting.
    Is it correctly wired as shown in the wiring manual? (Holley EFI Wiring Manual - LINK) - Yes
    Fuel, Sensors, System (Engine & Ignition Parameters), Idle & Spark ICFs programmed correctly?
    Disconnect the ECU Main Power Harness for 20 minutes/2 hours. This "resets" some unusual ECU issues. - Done many times.

  7. #7

    Default

    If it starts when fuel is manually added directly to intake, then has spark and air, but isn't getting enough fuel (for the air) from injectors while cranking. If it keeps running on its own once started, it obviously has everything it needs, so we can focus on cranking first and transition to run second.
    So the problem is either too much air or not enough fuel while cranking.
    I’m assuming you’re not touching gas pedal when cranking. If you do, all bets are off as we have no control of air.
    Too much air can be from:
    •Throttle blades open too much (idle stop or someone touching the pedal).
    •IAC open too much.
    •Air leak somewhere.
    •You can try reducing some air if you see something obvious, but big engines with big cams may need quite a bit of air.
    Too little fuel can be a couple of things:
    •Fuel pressure drops during cranking, i.e. pump loses power while key in start position.
    •Injectors don’t get power during cranking (seems like you checked this, but I’d double check).
    •Too little fuel requested in configuration (Cranking Fuel, Fuel Prime).
    •Keep adding some cranking fuel at your temp point and see if starts firing.
    The RPM to transition from cranking to run is defined in System -> Ignition Parameters -> Cranking Parameters. With cranking air and fuel you should get it to fire up enough to get past that point pretty consistently, even if it dies right after.
    Once you get past cranking, things get a bit more complex. Base Fuel, Fuel Modifiers and After Start Enrichment combined need to yield enough fuel flow during transition from cranking to stable run. At the same time, throttle idle position and IAC need to let in enough air. Let’s troubleshoot that if needed.

  8. #8
    Join Date
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    Default

    Rlwolf74, please post your Global File! See post #5 above.

  9. #9

    Default

    If this didn't work, I'll have to figure out how to load the files.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Connecticut
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    That's not your Global Configuration File (HEFI File), that's just the information Text Document (.hefi.info file). Read post #5 again.
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385"/6.3L SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, forged steel crank & rods, forged pistons, Trick Flow T/W 11R 205 CNC comp ported heads, 12:1 comp ratio, 232°-244° duration/.623" lift/114° LSA camshaft, TFS R-Series FTI comp ported intake, BBK 80mm T/B, Holley Dominator MPFI & DIS, Holley 36-1 crank trigger, MSD 1x cam sync, PA 200A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, R134a A/C, Spal dual 12" fans, Frostbite 3-core aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust, off-road X-pipe, shorty headers, Earl's -6AN fuel system plumbing, Walbro 255 LPH in-tank pump & Pro-M -6AN hanger, S&W subframe connectors, BMR upper & lower torque box reinforcements, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD, 3000 RPM converter, B&M Hammer shifter, Stifflers transmission crossmember & driveshaft safety loop, FPP aluminum driveshaft, FPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 M/T Street Comp tires.

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