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Thread: Coil-On-Plug & Terminator Questions

  1. #1
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    Nov 2015
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    Louisville, KY
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    Question Coil-On-Plug & Terminator Questions

    Wonder if you guys could take a look at this configuration and let me know if I'm on the right track. My car is a 1973 Camaro Z28 with a SBC. The engine was built before I bought the car. I talked to the guy that did the work and he couldn't remember exactly what was done. The best he could give me was it was blueprinted, stroked to a 363, and has a moderate cam, but he couldn't remember what he put in it. We've had the timing cover off and the cam isn't stamped on the end so I really have no idea what's there. It pulls around 10-12 inHg of vacuum at idle and sounds sort of like '70s LT1 cam but it's hydraulic. The engine was dynoed at about 410 HP before I bought it.

    It's currently running a Quick Fuel HR 680VS carb with a large cap HEI distributor. The car runs good, but we're looking to make the move to EFI. About 2 years ago, I bought a Terminator 550-406 kit and installed it. There was a problem getting it to run correctly, so we sent it back to Holley along with the throttle body and they determined the ECU was bad, and replaced it with a brand new HP. By that time we had to put the carb setup back on the car so we could get it to a couple of shows and auto cross competitions, and the carb has been on it ever since.

    Roll forward to today and I'm ready to get the EFI put back on. But I'd also like to get rid of the HEI and move to a Coil-On-Plug ignition system. I know the HP EFI is very capable of doing this, but I wanted to make sure I'm looking at the right parts. I'm planning on keeping the Terminator throttle body, and the main harness from the original kit has already been installed, so I'd prefer not to have to rip that back out.

    Here's the list I've come up with:
    MSD 23753 or Holley 565-200BK - Dual Sync EFI Distributor
    Holley 558-307 Universal LS Coil Harness
    MSD 84323 or Holley 566-103 Blank Distributor Cap

    For coils, I have a coil and bracket assembly from EFI Connection, prewired with an LS style wiring harness.
    Am I missing anything? Is there a good baseline tune I can download from Holley that will get the engine fired up and running?
    Is there anything else I need to consider? Thanks in advance, I really appreciate it. Let me know if I've left anything out. Chuck

  2. #2
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    Dec 2009
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    Connecticut
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    Originally Posted by Danny Cabral
    If you already have or you're purchasing a new Holley EFI non-LSx main harness:
    The Holley 558-307 CNP main harness is for Holley's Coil-On-Plug smart coils and LSx ignition coils (nine terminated loose wires into J1B).
    If using Holley's 556-112 CNP coils, the Holley 558-318 CNP coil sub-harness is also required (or the Holley 556-128 CNP Big Wire V8 Kit).
    For LSx coils, Holley 558-307 CNP main harness plugs into two GM 12579355 CNP sub-harnesses or Holley 558-321 LSx coil sub-harnesses.
    If you had a Holley EFI LSx main harness, you wouldn't need the Holley 558-307 CNP main harness or the 558-318 CNP coil sub-harness.
    https://www.holley.com/products/igni...nd_components/ (Holley EFI Coil-Near-Plug Ignition Components)
    https://www.holley.com/products/igni.../parts/556-128 (Holley EFI 556-128 Coil-Near-Plug Big Wire V8 Kit)
    https://www.holley.com/products/fuel.../parts/558-117 (Holley EFI 558-117 Universal MPFI Coil-Near-Plug Main Harness)
    https://www.holley.com/products/fuel.../parts/558-118 (Holley EFI 558-118 Ford Universal MPFI Coil-Near-Plug Main Harness)
    https://forums.holley.com/showthread...3038#post33038 (Detailed Crank Trigger & CNP/DIS Conversion Information & Reasoning)

    Most people find this document very helpful:
    http://documents.holley.com/efi_sele...chart62914.pdf (Holley HP & Dominator EFI Component Selection Guide)
    With the Dominator EFI, everything is sold separately. Use Summit Racing's shopping cart for a total price.
    The HP ECU only has four Inputs & four Outputs. If you need more than that, you'll need the Dominator ECU:
    http://documents.holley.com/techlibr...useanddiff.pdf (Holley HP & Dominator ECU Differences)

    EFI Software Help Information/Instructions:
    ‒ On the top Toolbar, click "Help" & "Contents". This opens all Help topics.
    ‒ When navigating the software, click "Help ?", drag it to any parameter and click again.
    ..This automatically opens the definitions for that specific parameter.
    ‒ Tuning information can be read by clicking the F1 key, when you're viewing any screen.
    http://documents.holley.com/techlibrary_199r10544.pdf (Holley EFI Help/Instructions Overview)
    http://documents.holley.com/techlibr...r10546rev1.pdf (Holley EFI Quick Start Guide)
    http://documents.holley.com/techlibr...10555rev17.pdf (Holley EFI Wiring Manual & Diagrams)
    http://forums.holley.com/showthread....ents-Read-This! (Initial Checks & Adjustments - Read Steps #1-#6!)
    Open the Holley EFI software "Help" Contents ("Help" drop down menu), and read "Step-By-Step Beginners Tuning".
    Ensure the EFI software is set to run as an "Administrator" (right click for Properties/Advanced). Set it and forget it.
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  3. #3
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    Nov 2015
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    Louisville, KY
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    Danny, thanks for the info and the links. I looked at the wiring diagrams for the 558-414 Terminator main harness and the 558-117 Universal COP main harness; after looking at the diagrams, one of the main differences is the IAC, TPS, MAP, and injectors are combined into one bulkhead connector on the Terminator TBI. So I'd want to keep Terminator wiring harness if I keep the Terminator TBI. Is it correct for me to assume that the 558-307 Universal Coil LS Coil Harness can be retrofitted into the P1B connector on the Terminator main harness? And then either use the Dual Sync EFI distributor or a crank trigger with a cam phase distributor? I really appreciate your help! Chuck

  4. #4
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    The Terminator EFI ECU is an HP EFI ECU, just a different decal. The Holley 558-307 CNP main harness doesn't connect to the main harness. The Holley 558-307 CNP main harness has terminals attached on the nine wires for connecting into the J1B ECU connector. Please read the instructions (LINK) and note the wiring diagram.
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  5. #5
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    Thanks. I used the wrong terminology. I don't have a Terminator EFI ECU anymore, Holley swapped it for an HP EFI CPU. But I still have the Terminator main harness in the car. I see where the 9 wires attach to the J1B connector. (I thought I read that you could use J/P interchangeably, sorry if that was the confusion.) When I said it could be retrofitted, I meant could be added to the J1B part of the harness in the appropriate pins. Does that make more sense?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by landpilot View Post
    Thanks. I used the wrong terminology. I don't have a Terminator EFI ECU anymore, Holley swapped it for an HP EFI CPU.
    It doesn't matter, they're the same ECU.

    But I still have the Terminator main harness in the car.
    It does matter. The Holley 558-307 CNP main harness doesn't connect to the main harness, it connects the the ECU P1B/J1B connector.

    I see where the 9 wires attach to the J1B connector. (I thought I read that you could use J/P interchangeably, sorry if that was the confusion.)
    Yes, you can use them interchangeably.

    When I said it could be retrofitted, I meant could be added to the J1B part of the harness in the appropriate pins. Does that make more sense?
    Yes, the Holley 558-307 CNP main harness has terminals attached on the nine wires for connecting into the P1B/J1B ECU connector (not the main harness).
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  7. #7
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    Thanks, I think we’re on the same page.

  8. #8
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    You're welcome.
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  9. #9
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    Danny, I've got a follow-up question. I want to be sure I can get the Terminator TBI up & running before we add in the COP. I was looking at the tech articles you linked to, especially the base calibrations. The Terminator uses 80 lb/hr injectors, but the TBI calibrations listed are for 85 lb/hr injectors. I'm assuming there are other differences as well for the IAC, etc.

    Is there somewhere I can get a base calibration file for the Terminator TBI that has all of the right settings to get it running? If not, how would I find out what the base settings are to modify one of the other TBI calibrations? Thank you

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by landpilot View Post
    The Terminator uses 80 lb/hr injectors, but the TBI calibrations listed are for 85 lb/hr injectors.
    You just select the Terminator part number in the Fuel System/System Type (Engine Parameters).

    I'm assuming there are other differences as well for the IAC, etc.
    Advanced Idle Control - "Holley 4BBL TBI".

    Is there somewhere I can get a base calibration file for the Terminator TBI that has all of the right settings to get it running?
    I attached the Terminator TBI base calibration here: Terminator.zip
    http://forums.holley.com/showthread....ents-Read-This! (Initial Checks & Adjustments - Read Steps #1-#6!)
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

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