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Thread: 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

  1. #1

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    I had a shop install the MSD Atomic EFI system on my supercharged 347 1965 Mustang Fastback last October. I initially picked up the car in November but it had some hot start problems and also the charging system was not working. Took the car back to the shop and had a new alternator installer and they fixed the hot start issues and a few other problems I had.



    Got the car back but I am still have some issues. I have lost faith in the shop and I am trying to learn and just remedy this myself. I found that the block is not grounded to the firewall, I will fix that and I will also be running a negative all the way to the block from the trunk mounted battery as it may fix my on going charging system issues.



    There is some serious hesitation under partial boost. Car starts easy, no problem re-starting after it is hot. It idles smooth, just the hesitation under partial boost. By hesitation I mean like it is bogging intermittently as I am accelerating gradually.


    Sorry if I am missing information. I am trying best I can what exactly they did while installing the system. The owner cannot tell me as he had a technician do the work and nothing was documented or they simply cannot remember. Please let me know if you need any additional information...


    347 Coast High Performance Block

    T5, Ford 9” 3.89 Detroit Locker

    Paxton NOVI 1200 Supercharger (5-6psi)

    Anderson Racing B31 Camshaft 220/222 .490/.530 110

    Edelbrock Performer Intake Manifold 2121

    Edelbrock 60269 – Performer RPM Cylinder Head w/2.02 in. intake valves

    MSD 6a Ignition Control

    MSD 8202 Blaster 2 Ignition Coil

    MSD 8579 Distributor

    Aeromotive Stealth Fuel Tank and Pump w/ return



    Current firmware is

    Dash: 2.0.7

    ECU: 1.2.10

    Power mod: 1.0.9



    Camshaft Type: Mild

    Fuel Pump Type: Non PWM with regulator

    Idle RPM Target: 1025

    Rev Limit: 6100



    Ignition Timing

    Idle RPM: 975

    Total RPM: 1975

    Idle Advance: 13.5

    Total Advance: 34.0

    Vacuum Advance: 0

    Vacuum type:

    Nitrous Retard: Off

    Boost Retard: 4.0



    A/F Targets

    Idle: 14.0

    Cruise: 13.8

    WOT: 11.0

    Boost: 11.5

    Pump Squirt: 38%

    Power Valve Enrich: 5%



    The shop has the fuel pressure at 66-68psi, from what I have been reading, that is way too high. I also do not see that they utilized the boost port on the fuel regulator, I saw that it was mentioned in all the other supercharged threads for the fuel pressure to rise as the boost climbs



    Youtube video of car starting (cold) and idling
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3s4wwF288A




    Idling
    Tach: 1093rpm

    ECT: 148F
    IAT:43F
    TPS: 0
    Map: 13.1" HG
    Fuel Press: 68 psi

    Bat Volts: 12.0v
    A/F Ratio: 13.9 AFR

    Inj Duty: 5%
    IGN Timing: 15.5 Deg
    IAC Pos: 12





    Thanks in advance,

    robb


  2. #2

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    The video shows the IAC POS to be at 175 while the engine is idling.

    Have you checked the throttle blade adjustment?

    How many turns open are the throttle blade screws?

  3. #3

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    I watched the video, is this the current way it runs now? Appears that the charging issue (11.5V) is at the beginning and then towards the end I see 12.4V. You mentioned that you fixed the charging issue so I am wondering if this has the initial issues and at the end it's the current issues. At the end I see IAC cnt at 12.



    Is this a typo in your settings above, if not they are reversed.

    Idle RPM Target: 1025

    Idle RPM: 975



    Idle RPM should be 100 above target.

  4. #4

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    MSD Atomic EFI Support wrote:

    The video shows the IAC POS to be at 175 while the engine is idling.

    Have you checked the throttle blade adjustment?

    How many turns open are the throttle blade screws?





    As of yet I have not checked that. That will be on the top of my list as I am still hunting down why my charging system is not working. Already added ground cable all the way to the block and replaced the engine to firewall ground strap the shop simply cut off. So far I have not figured out why my new alternator is not working. They swapped the original 3 wire style to a new 140amp TuffStuff single wire.



    What should the IAC POS be at normally while idling?



    bojo wrote:

    I watched the video, is this the current way it runs now? Appears that the charging issue (11.5V) is at the beginning and then towards the end I see 12.4V. You mentioned that you fixed the charging issue so I am wondering if this has the initial issues and at the end it's the current issues. At the end I see IAC cnt at 12.



    Is this a typo in your settings above, if not they are reversed.

    Idle RPM Target: 1025

    Idle RPM: 975



    Idle RPM should be 100 above target.

    Yes, this is currently how the car starts and runs. The settings in the post above is how they set it up.



    The video is all still with charging issues. Cold start, idle, all in one go, just pieced together. When the car warms up the IAC is in the teens.



    Yes, the car keeps its voltage around 11.1-12.1 volts when running. If I turn the radio (just a normal fm radio, nothing fancy on dash speaker) and lights on I instantly dip to 10.1-10.4volts. Various RPM do not change the voltage back to the battery and I double checked with a multi-meter and still cannot find why my alternator is only putting out 11.98 volts. Having a buddy pick up a new PowerMaster tonight from Summit to install and see if maybe the shop somehow shorted out the internal regulator on the TuffStuff they install (not even sure if that is possible?)



    I checked the photos I took and yes, that is correct;

    Idle RPM: 975
    Total RPM: 1975

    Idle RPM Target: 1025



    I will make a note to change that as soon as I find this charging issue.




  5. #5

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    The Atomic needs a good 12V source so this could be an issue when you are getting 10v. My system puts out 13.7v when charging. Just some thoughts.

  6. #6

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    I fixed my charging issues by adding/replacing ground cables. Charging to 14.2 volts and with all accessories on I am staying around 11.9-12.3 volts.

    I made the change you suggested and noticed my car doesn't feel like with wants to stall when engaging the clutch anymore. By that I mean the RPM's use to dip below 1000 when changing gears to pressing the clutch while braking.

    I still have the same hesitation issues while under partial boost. I will make a new video and show my parameters.

    I also found some new problems;

    • Bypass valve connected to Paxton manifold and not to ports on MSD atomic. I never sees vacuum and technically never dumps the boost when letting off the gas.
    • Boost gauge connected same way, explains why the car never shows it is in vacuum


    I have attached a file but I am convinced that I need to connect both the boost gauge and bypass valve directly to the MSD atomic vacuum ports for then to function properly.

    I am also unsure about using the boost reference port on the atomic efi. My fuel pressure stays at a constant 68 psi.

    Attached files


  7. #7

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    Good to hear that 1 of the issues is fixed. Is your system a Blow-thru or Draw-thu system?



    Not familiar with supercharging so won't be much help to you. Just curious as to whether you have the Boost Reference Port set up correctly with the Atomic.

  8. #8

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    It is a Paxton NOVI 1200 - Blow through supercharger.

    After some more reading it looks like the boost reference is only used on draw-through supercharger?

  9. #9

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    Yeah, it's should be ok.



    Found this:



    The ignition advance curve, in general, is quicker yet shorter than an engine without a supercharger, this helps give better throttle response until the boost pressure kicks in. The advance curve most seen is an initial timing of 18 degrees with a total of 32 degrees; this is just a starting point and must be tailored to each engine.





    Also what are your spark plugs gapped to?

  10. #10

    Default 347 w/ Paxton Blower Settings Help!

    I believe it is the opposite. The blow-thru setup like yours should have air box pressure connected to the reference port on the fuel pressure regulator. In order to maintain a constant pressure drop across the injector orifice, the fuel pressure should rise at a 1:1 ratio with manifold pressure.



    As you noted already, the blow-off valve and vacuum / boost gauge should be connected to the throttle body base plate using one of the "unported" taps (i.e. one that taps into manifold pressure below the throttle blades).

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