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Thread: New Member. Some questions please.

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by CK & his '55 TBird View Post
    ...go into the Learn Table and press Transfer Learning To Base Fuel Table.
    This will alter the Base Fuel Table to match your conditions, yet you will have to do this
    a couple of times though taking the car out each time for a drive in varied conditions, etc.
    No, "Transferring Learning To Base" does not alter the Base Fuel Table at all.

    The Learn Table is a modifier of the Base Fuel Table. These two tables actually function together as one, because the Learn Table values are directly applied to the Base Fuel Table. The Learn Table just indicates how much the Base Fuel Table has been altered (modified). The Base Fuel Table values don't change, unless you Transfer Learning To Base (which then allows you to blend the Fuel Graph so it's smooth). It's the Learn Table itself, that contains constantly changing values. When the Learn Table values stop making significant changes, the ECU is finished self-tuning. Read this forum thread:
    http://forums.holley.com/showthread....7370#post47370 (Learn Table - Read this thread, especially posts #2, #6 & #11.)
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  2. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CK & his '55 TBird View Post
    If you have to, just borrow a laptop and order a cable. The handheld won't help you.
    It's pretty simple once you get past the thought of it all.
    However, I'm still learning the system too, it gets easier as you go along.
    I have a 107° cam too, and thought it might not have been happy with it either, but I found no issue with reversion, etc.
    Once you do hook up the laptop simply, go into the Learn Table and press Transfer Learning To Base Fuel Table.
    This will alter the Base Fuel Table to match your conditions, yet you will have to do this
    a couple of times though taking the car out each time for a drive in varied conditions, etc.

    I noticed it's an old XA Falcon, so you must be a fellow Aussie. I'm in Melbourne area, are you local?
    Sunshine Coast, Queensland mate. And it's a ZG, so close. Did some more testing today, I do have low vacuum around 5-6 inches at idle, and 16 at 2000 RPM. Do you know how much manifold vacuum you have? Cheers.

  3. Default

    OK, so I put a vacuum gauge on today, not good low 5-6 inches. I also turned the throttle up about 2 more turns and reset the TPS. Now here is my question: When I did this, I ran engine up to temp. I held the revs up, then when I backed off, the idle was around 2000 rpm and the IAC (SHOULD BE CALLED ISC Idle Speed Control) was still in Hold mode 30%. So I put my finger over the IAC, the rpm dropped to a slow rich idle, with the IAC now working around 100%. Why is this so? YES, I DID RESET THE TPS MORE THAN ONCE TO BE SURE. Think this happen yesterday as well, but thought I must have forgot to reset it. I also at the same time had set target idle AFR to 15.5 and this was working while the RPM was at 2000 RPM, IAC Hold at 30%, TPS Position reading 0%. Any ideas? Cheers.
    Last edited by knightrider; 01-08-2016 at 06:02 AM.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by knightrider View Post
    I also turned the throttle up about 2 more turns and reset the TPS.
    You can't just turn the throttle up 2 turns. There's a relationship between the idle speed screw and the IAC Position (hot idle).

    Now here is my question: When I did this, I ran engine up to temp. I held the revs up, then when I backed off, the idle was around 2000 rpm and the IAC (SHOULD BE CALLED ISC Idle Speed Control) was still in hold mode 30%. So I put my finger over the IAC, the rpm dropped to a slow rich idle, with the IAC now working around 100%. Why is this so?
    Most likely because the TPS Position was between 0% & 1% (activating the IAC Hold Position), but since your finger was over the IAC air inlet port, the IAC motor was trying to raise the idle speed but couldn't.

    I also at the same time had set target idle AFR to 15.5 and this was working while the RPM was at 2000 RPM, IAC Hold at 30%, TPS Position reading 0%. Any ideas?
    Sometimes it's easier to block off the IAC air inlet port with a piece of tape, until you get the engine idling properly.

    ★ Initial Baseline Idle Speed Screw Setting ★:
    Sometimes the throttle blades are so far off adjustment, turning the idle speed screw triggers the IAC Hold Position.
    If this happens, the throttle blades will require a baseline setting without the IAC valve altering this adjustment.
    This must be accomplished with the engine at hot idle. Be careful of dangerous fan and belt driven components.
    With the air filter previously removed, block off the IAC air inlet port with your finger or a strong piece of tape.
    While temporarily ignoring the IAC Position, adjust the idle speed screw to the Target Idle Speed RPM (in Idle ICF).
    Turn engine off (remove tape). With the key-on/engine-off, perform a TPS AutoSet. Cycle key off & restart engine.
    Now only a minute adjustment will be required to achieve an IAC Position of about 2%. Perform a final TPS AutoSet.

    Ensure the TPS Position always returns to 0% at idle. If not, it activates the IAC Hold Position and raises the idle speed, causing issues.
    You may have to slightly back-off the idle speed screw (after a TPS AutoSet), so the TPS Position always returns to 0% (V3 improved this).
    Ensure your throttle linkage moves/returns freely (hot & cold), and usually a stronger throttle return spring is all that's necessary to rectify this.
    Also, if the IAC Hold Position is set too high, or the RPM Above Idle to Start Ramp is set too low, the engine RPM will hang & not return to idle:
    http://forums.holley.com/showthread....8236#post48236 (Read sentences highlighted in red.)
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  5. Default

    Thanks Danny, I will need to have another go. Still not sure why this is as when I did throttle adjustments I did reset the TPS and it was at zero. So I need to run the engine block the IAC adjust throttle until I reach target idle RPM Turn engine off (remove tape). With the key-on/engine-off, perform a TPS AutoSet. Cycle key off & restart engine.
    Now only a minute adjustment will be required to achieve an IAC Position of about 2%. Perform a final TPS AutoSet. What is (in Idle ICF)?

    When I blocked the IAC it was only for a second or two the idle dropped and I removed my finger (that sounds bad) idle was low and IAC was working at 100%. Also, not sure why if at 30% Hold, idle speed was 2000 RPM, but block IAC, idle drops. Unblock IAC, IAC goes to 100% but can't keep 900 rpm?
    Last edited by knightrider; 01-08-2016 at 07:52 AM.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by knightrider View Post
    What is (in Idle ICF)?
    ICF = Individual Configuration Files. Menu icons at top of EFI laptop software.

    When I blocked the IAC it was only for a second or two the idle dropped and I removed my finger (that sounds bad) idle was low and IAC was working at 100%. Also, not sure why if at 30% Hold, idle speed was 2000 RPM, but block IAC, idle drops. Unblock IAC, IAC goes to 100% but can't keep 900 rpm?
    With the IAC air inlet port blocked off, can you physically adjust the idle screw to the Target Idle Speed RPM?
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  7. Default

    I will do that next. I can't see why I wouldn't be able to adjust the throttle to 900 rpm with the IAC blocked. Other than if the manifold vacuum is so low at that rpm, that it's affecting the AFR. Will the ECU try to maintain Target A/F Ratio AND Idle speed with TPS at zero, regardless of MAP values? Or will the low MAP values create a rich idle, as the ECU is reading low vacuum? Cheers.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by knightrider View Post
    I will do that next. I can't see why I wouldn't be able to adjust the throttle to 900 rpm with the IAC blocked.
    Neither do I. Forget about the IAC valve for now; leave it blocked off. Just adjust the idle to 900 RPM and perform a TPS AutoSet.
    Then tune the Base Fuel Table (in the idle area), so it's not so rich. Lean (decrease) the lb/hr values. Tuning instructions in post #28.

    Will the ECU try to maintain Target A/F Ratio AND Idle speed with TPS at zero, regardless of MAP values?
    Yes, but the Target A/F Ratio Table is a 16x16 table, based on MAP kPa & RPM axes.

    Or will the low MAP values create a rich idle, as the ECU is reading low vacuum?
    It's possible. Connect a laptop computer to the ECU, and look at your Target A/F Ratio Table (Fuel ICF). Laptop connection instructions in post #28.
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

  9. Default

    Was unable to make it idle at 900 RPM with IAC blocked. It will idle when cold, but when it's hot, I only have 5 seconds at most before it stalls. I blocked the IAC and adjusted the idle screw while idling, only just super rich (trying to save plugs at this point). Did TPS reset. Unblock IAC. Turn ignition off then on, start & run, I hold the revs around 3000 rpm to clear some fuel. The vacuum is at 18 inches at this point. Then try and let it idle, same as yesterday. IAC holds 30% RPM around 2K. As soon as I block the IAC, RPM drops, vacuum drops instantly, before it's even at idle. So fuel is added super rich black smoke pouring out, only have seconds before it stalls. Plugs are toast takes 1 hour to change plugs. It just won't idle hot with low vacuum. I would try and open the throttle idle screw some more, but the IAC will be in Hold mode, even after TPS reset. I will be getting hold of a laptop, and tuning from there. But I still think I'm missing something. May need to advance cam timing to give it more vacuum at idle. (Major job engine out to do it properly.) Any ideas? Cheers.

    I know I need to lower fuel on deceleration, but ran out of time & patience. Plugs need to come out again, so it was time to walkaway.
    Last edited by knightrider; 01-09-2016 at 03:34 AM.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by knightrider View Post
    So fuel is added super rich black smoke pouring out, only have seconds before it stalls. Plugs are toast takes 1 hour to change plugs.
    Stop running the engine until you lean the Base Fuel Table in the idle area! Is your fuel pressure set at 43 psi?
    The excessively rich AFR, may be due to the base calibration. See post #9. I've mentioned this four times now.

    It just won't idle hot with low vacuum.
    It's idling with such low vacuum because it's excessively rich. It needs less fuel.

    I will be getting hold of a laptop, and tuning from there.
    YES! Try a different base calibration (see post #9), or lean the Base Fuel Table.

    But I still think I'm missing something. May need to advance cam timing to give it more vacuum at idle. (Major job engine out to do it properly.)
    No, that's not necessary at all! It just needs to be tuned. If the AFR is too rich, you must lean it out.
    May God's grace bless you in the Lord Jesus Christ.
    '92 Ford Mustang GT: 385" SBF, Dart SHP 8.2 block, TFS TW 11R 205 heads, 11.8:1 comp, TFS R-Series intake, Dominator MPFI & DIS, 36-1 crank trigger/1x cam sync, 160A 3G alternator, Optima Red battery, A/C, 100HP progressive dry direct-port NOS, Spal dual 12" fans/3-core Frostbite aluminum radiator, Pypes dual 2.5" exhaust/off-road X-pipe/shorty headers, S&W subframe connectors, LenTech Strip Terminator wide-ratio AOD/2800 RPM converter, M4602G aluminum driveshaft, FRPP 3.31 gears, Cobra Trac-Lok differential, Moser 31 spline axles, '04 Cobra 4-disc brakes, '93 Cobra booster & M/C, 5-lug Bullitt wheels & 245/45R17 tires.

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